President Trump criticized the UK’s stance on war against Iran as he welcomed the German chancellor to the White House.
Scott Ditrow, Host:
The US and Israeli war on Iran is straining relations with some US allies. Tonight, France’s president said the US and Israel were acting outside international law. The German Chancellor was at the White House the other day. President Trump gave Friedrich Merz a warm welcome, but he had some harsh words for other European countries.
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President Donald Trump: Spain is very uncooperative, and so is the UK
DETRO: We’re going to talk now with two NPR international correspondents, Rob Schmitz in Berlin and Lauren Freire in London. Hello to you both.
LAUREN FRAYER, BYLINE: Hello.
ROB SCHMITZ, BYLINE: Hello.
DETRO: Rob, I’m going to start with you. Chancellor Merz met President Trump today on a pre-scheduled official visit to the White House. What did they talk about?
SCHMITZ: Yes. President Trump has said a lot of good things about the merger. He called the merger a success. He said he was popular. He said the US was able to make deals with Germany. Merz later spoke to reporters in English and said Germany and the US were on the same page in removing what he called a “terrorist regime” in Iran. And he said he and Trump need to talk about what happens when the regime in Tehran is out of power. Merz mentions that the conflict has caused some economic chaos for Europe. Here’s what he said.
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Chancellor Friedrich Merz: This is true for oil prices, and it is also true for gas prices. That is why we all hope that this war will end as soon as possible. And we hope that the Israeli and American military are doing the right things to end this.
DETRO: Rob, how would Merz categorize what he said earlier when it comes to the transatlantic relationship?
SCHMITZ: Yes. The tone has changed a bit. You know, two weeks ago at the Munich Security Conference, I watched Chancellor Merz give a speech where he declared the order based on international rules dead. And this new order, he said, is the new reality of what he calls big power politics engineered by the Trump administration, Russia and China. And he called for Europe to unite to survive democracy. He characterized these great powers as international bullies. But now America and Israel have attacked Iran and Merz is supporting America in this effort. So it’s a bit of a reversal for Merz.
DETRO: Lauren, is it fair to say there’s a bit of a backlash in the United Kingdom as well?
Freyr: Yes, absolutely. So UK Prime Minister Keir Stormer initially said he would not allow the US to use British military bases to attack Iran. Spain also said, prompting that retort from Trump that you heard there. But then after the US and Israel started their war and retaliated against British allies in the Iranian Gulf, Stormer reversed himself. And now they are allowing the US to use British bases but in what they call a defensive manner.
DETRO: But what does that mean? Is the UK joining the war effort?
Freire: It’s a matter of perspective. The UK is sending a warship to defend its air base in Cyprus after it was hit by an Iranian drone. Stormer’s critics accuse him of calling the country an illegal war. One MP called Stormer Trump’s puppy. You remember what critics said about Tony Blair in 2003 when he joined the US-led Iraq war. They called him George W. Bush’s puppy.
But others compare the moment to a famous scene from a movie from two decades ago. The name of the film is “Love Actually”. It’s when the fictional Prime Minister, played by Hugh Grant, stands up to the intimidating American President. And Stormer made this impassioned speech in Parliament, saying that Britain does not believe in “regime change from the sky”. And he said this too.
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Prime Minister Keir Stormer: We all remember the mistakes of Iraq.
UNIDENTIFIED MAN: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED CROWD: Yes.
Starmer: And we learned those lessons.
FREYER: You know, Stormer doesn’t want to be Tony Blair, whose legacy is really damaged by that Iraq war decision. Millions of people were killed in that Iraq war, including around 180 British military personnel. But all this has left Trump very unhappy with Stormer right now.
DETRO: President Billy Bob Thornton sounds like he’s unhappy with Prime Minister Hugh Grant, but let’s talk more about reality. Why isn’t Trump happy with Stormer?
FREYER: He railed against the United Kingdom today in the Oval Office, and here’s part of what Trump said.
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Trump: This is not the age of Churchill. I would say the UK is very uncooperative.
FREYER: So Trump said Stormer wasn’t Churchill – it was Winston Churchill, the famous British Prime Minister of World War II. Incidentally, I recently interviewed Churchill’s grandson a few days ago. He himself is a senior UK politician. He accused Trump of destabilizing the US-UK special relationship, that longstanding allowance-alliance. And he told me his grandfather didn’t like Trump. It’s worth noting that Stormer really likes Trump. I mean, he’s not a critic of Trump in general. But Stormer is also looking domestically, and polls show that more Britons oppose than support US military action against Iran.
DETRO: Finally, Rob, I’ll come back to you. We asked what the German leadership had to say about this. How did the Germans view this war?
SCHMITZ: Yes. A poll by a national broadcaster over the weekend showed that 59% of Germans do not support these attacks by the US and Israel on Iran. Lauren mentions how unpopular the Iraq war is in the UK, which means it’s really unpopular with Germans. And in many ways, Germany had to deal with the destabilizing effects of that war, which led to instability across the Middle East over the next decade and later morphed into the Arab Spring. More than a million migrants from the Middle East eventually found refuge in Germany. And this, in turn, fueled the rise of the right wing here.
Merz himself warned last weekend that the war in Iran could turn into an Afghanistan or Iraq-style quagmire with a profound impact on Europe. And they’re talking about Europe bracing for another wave of migrants, except this time from Iran. And Germany’s political parties have little tolerance for that scenario.
DETRO: That’s NPR’s Berlin correspondent Rob Schmitz and London correspondent Lauren Freyer. Thank you both so much.
Freyr: You’re welcome.
SCHMITZ: Thank you.
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